bernie-youngblood-and-utkarsh.txt Utkarsh Narang (00:01.293) In a world that's driven by culture, technology, chaos, today, Bernie and I are going to speak what it means to be human. We will speak about the idea of human potential in this age of AI. And hopefully, by the end of it, you'll know that whether machines are going to help us rediscover our divine intelligence that is within ourselves or not. Bernie, how are you today? Bernie Youngblood (00:24.702) I'm great. And you nailed it right in the head. In a world of chaos. And it's getting crazier every day. Utkarsh Narang (00:32.685) By the minute, by the minute. Bernie Youngblood (00:34.816) and I'm in the United States, so we know our crazy. We have all the flavors. Utkarsh Narang (00:38.127) You do, you do. Should we just start from that aspect of craziness? Bernie Youngblood (00:45.177) I love it. I'm here for it. Let's go. Utkarsh Narang (00:47.799) Let's do it. Let's do it. I think the first question, Bernie, that we begin the podcast, we want to put put the listeners into the deep end with both of us. If that eight year old Bernie, wherever that eight year old and it was a very different United States many years ago, eight year old Bernie comes and meets you right now. What kind of a conversation will emerge between the two of you? Bernie Youngblood (01:09.944) Wait, so this is my eight-year-old self come to visit me here now. Utkarsh Narang (01:12.815) 8 year, kid. Absolutely. Yes, sir. Bernie Youngblood (01:17.917) my goodness. Now do I get to tell him the future? Utkarsh Narang (01:21.903) up to you whether you want to listen to about the past or talk to him about the future. Bernie Youngblood (01:27.234) Well, I've never had a question put to me precisely like that. But I've always followed the precept that if I had to do it all over again, I would change nothing. So I would, now my eight year old, we were raised by my mother with no father. My mother was divorced twice. My wife, in fact, was raised by her mother, no father. She was divorced twice. it's one of those families, a very common family story nowadays. And my eight-year-old self, I would be aware, is about to embark upon quite a lot of, I'll say, distress in his life. And if I were to communicate anything to him, I would tell him, coming from his older self, speaking with some authority, although my eight-year-old self, probably wouldn't listen to me anyway. But I would tell him, you're going to be okay. It's going to be, it's going to be, it's not going to be easy, not going to lie, but you're going to get through it. I'd want to communicate that. I'd want to communicate that to him as best I could. And I think that it's important to communicate that to the younger generation even today. because they're entering a world, if you were born in the, my oldest son was born in 2001. So as a three month old, he witnessed what we call September 11th, which is a traumatic thing for us. And then, you know, economic crashes and war and all kinds of tumult. I think it's important to communicate to one another that we're going to be okay. At the moment, we might not be okay. In fact, we're definitely not okay. But we're going to be okay. This too shall pass as the saying goes. Utkarsh Narang (03:26.521) Mm. Utkarsh Narang (03:37.475) These are just four words, right? This too shall pass. And I'm emphasizing on that what you've said that it's going to be okay. Is it a, is it a, and a lot of this conversation also on recency bias, I was just watching a TEDx talk of an hour ago. Is it when we say this too shall pass, it'll all be over, it'll be okay, it'll work out. Is that toxic positivity or is it something else? Bernie Youngblood (04:06.574) It might be. actually I had a podcast I had a guest on last week and she was talking about toxic positivity and her suggestion was instead of positive thinking, instead embark upon this thing that she calls decided thinking. Make a decision and do the thing. But to address it more specifically, I think it's just physics. Nature abhors a vacuum entropy is a natural state the the only constant in the universe is change Wow, I'm full of platitudes aren't I the but for real it is I Hate using the word literally, but it is literally possible literally impossible to keep something steady state right enter the all matter wants to fly apart All change, all matter is in a constant state of change. So unfortunately as humans, we tend to think, I'm sad, I'm gonna be sad forever, this is bad, it's gonna be bad forever. It's impossible for something to be bad forever. It's impossible for someone to be sad forever. We have to get beyond that level of thinking because you could go spiritual, you could... You can look at it from a spiritual standpoint, right? And you can look at it from a just raw physics. It's not possible. It's gonna change. And coin toss, good or bad, right? But rest assured, it's gonna change. Utkarsh Narang (05:40.504) Hmm. Utkarsh Narang (05:46.254) Mmm. Utkarsh Narang (05:51.747) I love this comparison you just did and there's a hidden doctor in me. that little 20 years ago, that boy remembers this physics that he was taught. It's just amazing. I've never thought about this. So all matter wants to change the atoms and the molecules and whatever we can talk about. They're wanting to rip apart and move from a solid to a liquid to a gas state. Bernie Youngblood (06:10.766) Yes. Bernie Youngblood (06:16.877) Yes. Utkarsh Narang (06:19.736) Tell me more, tell me more. I'm intrigued. I need to learn more about that idea because the physicist in me is asking me like, is it the need to energy? Is it the need to fly away? What is the matter's need to change this state? Bernie Youngblood (06:21.966) Ha Bernie Youngblood (06:34.796) Well, careful. We're gonna go deep on this one. Keeping in mind, and I'm not a physicist, nor do I play one on television, the keeping in mind, we like to think that our scientists know things. We like to think we're pretty smart. Okay, well, let's start with that. Ask an educated scientist, right, what is an electron? How do you measure the speed of an electron? Last I checked, science considers electrons to be something to the tune of a cloud. A lot of scientists have not yet decided whether or not light is wave or particle. There's an argument to be made that there's no such thing as solid. That granite countertop is made of protons, neutrons, electrons. facts, right? And the distance between those protons and neutrons is like the distance between football fields, right? The, in fact, that granite countertop is so porous, right, on a quantum scale, if you will, I'm borrowing references I don't even myself understand, you can fly an aircraft carrier through it. There's no such thing as a solid. So let's start with the fact that, to put it quite simply, we know nothing and less every day. To take it one step further, people would say time is a construct. So if there's no such thing as a solid, electrons are clouds, light is particle or wave, we're not quite sure and time is a construct, what are we doing here? So now we get to the spiritual because as a lot of... a lot of scientists would say, the deeper you go into the physics, if you will, the closer you get to the spiritual. Because with our primitive human minds, because human minds are quite primitive, we have a very difficult time understanding our physical reality. And at a certain point, have no idea, no, no. Bernie Youngblood (09:00.902) choice but to trust the spiritual definition of our reality. So yeah, it's an interesting intellectual exercise. Try telling that to a five-year-old. Not only are you in a constant state of change, but you don't actually exist. Utkarsh Narang (09:25.358) the existential crisis. You take me to the existential crisis. I go ahead. Bernie Youngblood (09:29.986) Right? It's... And all that being said, I'm going to take it one step further. The only thing that counts is love. And I learned that... From the Bible? No. Yes, yes, I learned that from the Bible, but I love to point out that it's reinforced by the movie, The Fifth Element, starring Bruce Willis. One of my favorite scenes of the movie, when the robot's about to die and our protagonist is concerned about the robot's survival, the robot says, life does not matter, only love. Or something like that, I'm paraphrasing. Love. I'm going to go ahead and I'm going go out in a limb here and proclaim is one of the is one of a very few things that is eternal. Put love out into the universe. That's a good thing. And it will come back to you. How did we get there? Wow. We went deep fast. my goodness. Utkarsh Narang (10:34.51) So we did what happened here. We've felt the last 10 minutes ago. Let me try and bring it all together for myself and then through that, I'm with you, I'm with you. We started with that eight year old. Bernie Youngblood (10:46.19) Please help me out here. I'm drowning. Bernie Youngblood (10:54.306) Yes. What a screwed up kid that was. my god. Utkarsh Narang (10:55.234) And nothing had to change from where we were to where I think this conversation screwed him up. He was okay. He was doing okay. He would have been fine. Yeah. But now one day he'll be sitting in a, in a wooden cabin talking to someone called Utkarsh on the other side of the world, recording a podcast on the other side of the world. This too shall pass. I think that's where we were. And I so deeply resonate with that message because nothing is permanent. Bernie Youngblood (11:04.94) Yeah, it would have been fine. Bernie Youngblood (11:14.636) on the other side of the world. Utkarsh Narang (11:24.886) And still we keep repeating this cliche with a certain sense of guilt and doubt that change is the only constant, nothing is permanent. We keep doing that. But it's really, I think what this is doing for me, Bernie, and I know how listeners are feeling about this. It's hitting home that we can say that this too shall pass, but we need to really live it. And whether we go the physical. side of things or we go deep down into the spiritual they both are saying the same thing that no state is permanent. Bernie Youngblood (12:00.962) Yes. Yes, you have a very short time. Life is short. You have a very short time period on this earth. How are you going to spend it? Are you going to spend it racing cars? Are you going to spend it gambling? Are you going to spend it at your desk? Are you going to spend it doing evil? Or are you going to spend it giving love? Right? Sharing kindness. Helping as another podcast I listen to describes the Utkarsh Narang (12:20.014) Hmm. Hmm. Bernie Youngblood (12:32.994) Be good to yourself and help someone else out if you can, right? During these few short moments that you have, that you've been granted by whatever God you pray to, Is it possible that you can make the universe a little bit better than how you found it? Pour that love that you've been provided out into the universe and allow others to enjoy it. But don't take that the wrong way. I mean, brotherly. Utkarsh Narang (13:03.444) Bernie Youngblood (13:03.608) Kindness, let's say that's a let's say it that way Utkarsh Narang (13:09.518) I'm listening to you and I'm thinking this choice that's been given to us, the choice of this short time that we are going to be on this planet and how do we want to spend that choice? And yes, you could do any of those things, right? Race cars, gamble, go and murder someone or use it for positive means. What's your understanding? What helps us make the choice of who we want to be? Bernie Youngblood (13:41.132) Wow. Well, that's an important question. I haven't really given that a lot of thought. What makes, wait, say that, ask that one more time. Utkarsh Narang (13:51.311) So this short time on the planet that we have, we can choose however we want to spend our time on this planet. Utkarsh Narang (14:04.278) What propels us to choose something? Bernie Youngblood (14:10.062) Someone said, I heard recently that someone said most all the problems in the world today can be explained simply by considering man's inability to live in silence. to fill the void with noise. And as I've been told, that if you were to submerge yourself into a sound deprivation tank, isolation tank, I forget what it's called, that you go crazy. And I've given that a great deal of thought. I'd like to try it someday, go into a sound deprivation tank. And there's these challenges. Mr. Beast does a challenge where if you can... live in a grocery store for 30 days all by yourself, I'll give you a million dollars or something like that. There's all these challenges. And I can't, keep thinking to myself, how is it possible that someone can be so erratic that they can't spend 30 days with themselves and no one else? I suppose until I do it myself, I won't understand. But there's this theory that that explains away most of the world's problems. We have a... and we have unresolved issues from our childhood, something that happened to us at some point in our lives, unresolved issues that we project out into the world. We were wronged, therefore we must reflect that back into the world. And this is theory that I'm familiar with, that I myself am still trying to make sense of, still trying to evaluate, because It doesn't make sense to me. Bernie Youngblood (15:59.734) Because as you described, the key word popularized by the movie The Matrix, the difference is choice. You get to choose how you react to any given situation. When someone walks up to you and puts their finger in your chest or shoves you, the adrenaline starts pumping, fight or flight, all these things. are chemical reactions in progress. We are programmed. Utkarsh Narang (16:05.966) Hmm. Bernie Youngblood (16:28.75) through thousands of years or tens of thousands of years, depending on your perspective of evolution, fight or flight. But what makes us different from animals? We have... forgive the word, I'm not a philosopher, a consciousness that is able to discern between these reactions. We do not have to automatically respond. We have the ability to think and to reason, unlike AI, which currently cannot, to my knowledge, think or reason, not yet, not yet, right? But we have the ability to think and to reason. If someone shoves you, Utkarsh Narang (16:51.694) you Utkarsh Narang (17:06.38) No, that's the keyword. Bernie Youngblood (17:13.812) don't have to shove them back. And I'm going to go ahead and insert here an addendum to suggest and come full circle. The most powerful force in the universe is, wait for it, love. And there's no enemy that I have faced that given sufficient time I have not defeated with love. As it's biblical, as described in the Bible, it's like pouring hot coals on the head of your enemy to love them. So before I might suggest, before you shove back, if you have the wherewithal, you might try love. Bernie Youngblood (18:02.19) and have to choose it, of course. So I don't know if I can answer that question, but I gave it my best shot. That's tough one. Utkarsh Narang (18:09.176) Hmm, it was a good shot. It was a good shot. Before I respond to that, Mr. Beast, if you're listening to this video, if you're listening to this video, then it's time you do a sound deprivation challenge and you have Bernie and Utkarsh who are okay flying from the US and Australia to wherever you want us to, to be on that because then, finally then, I will get my kids' admiration because I'll be on Mr. Beast's Bernie Youngblood (18:17.57) Yes. Yes. Bernie Youngblood (18:24.876) Yes! I'm in! Bernie Youngblood (18:35.576) We'll do a content who can survive the longest. Utkarsh Narang (18:38.004) who will survive the longest? It's going to be a good one. But here's, I love where you're taking us, right? So you spoke about consciousness and none of us are experts, right? We're all trying to stream what the universe is giving into us through this podcast to the listener who's listening and Spotify and Apple podcasts are helping us do that. But it's the universe that's streaming through us right now. I love that idea, universe streaming through us. Let's talk about that separately. Bernie Youngblood (18:39.928) Yes, I'm in. Bernie Youngblood (19:04.333) Yes. Utkarsh Narang (19:05.272) But what you're saying is that that consciousness gets to choose and the power there to help that consciousness evolve to choose the right thing to me is love. But love has a very MTV definition that is popularized. Let's go down that rabbit hole. What's love? What is love? Bernie Youngblood (19:21.656) Yes. Yes. Yes. Bernie Youngblood (19:30.626) Love for me, and it's gonna be, I think different folks are gonna have different definitions, right? I think that's allowed. Love for me is the ability to step into someone else's shoes and feel their pain. And in so doing, if you inflict pain upon them, you're only hurting yourself. And so I've never been in a fight. I'm a 55-year-old man. I've never been in a fight. Not a physical fight. I've been yelled at and yelled back once or twice. But I do not seem to possess the programming to be able to physically hurt anyone. I think that's because of how I view how I love my brothers and sisters, my fellow human beings. Have I hurt them? I'm just hurting myself. Utkarsh Narang (20:34.446) I'm taking a pause. There's a part of me that there's a large part of me that agrees to it. And so I often tell my kids and they say, the elder one would say, the young one's doing this. Why don't you scold him? Why don't you give him like a tight slap and he'll be fixed for life? And I tell them both that I don't have the capability of shouting. I don't have the capability of hurting you. I don't have the capability of being rude to someone. Until as they come and threaten me, maybe, maybe I'll like, maybe I'll raise my voice a little bit, like maybe kindly raise my voice. Sir, please don't, don't hurt me because I'm not doing any. Bernie Youngblood (21:16.27) You're a better man than I. I've certainly raised my voice to one or more people in my life, I'm ashamed of saying. Utkarsh Narang (21:26.562) We all have, who's counting? Who's counting money? Who's counting? But here's the thought then, right? Bernie Youngblood (21:28.686) All right, yes. Utkarsh Narang (21:33.975) It's not that we're all, I think we're all capable of this love, right? But it gets lost somewhere on the way. And so if we speak about that, my hypothesis is that if we speak about that, if we spread that message today that people can understand and take home and think and say that I'm going to be my unconditionally loving self to my fellow human beings in all shapes, sizes, forms, creeds, preferences, opinions, whatever. Bernie Youngblood (21:38.85) Yes. Yes. Utkarsh Narang (22:03.532) then we will make this a better world and we'll hopefully unlock human potential. What do you think? That's too big of a task for both of us. Bernie Youngblood (22:10.9) It's, well, know, boy, okay, here we go. So here's the problem. Okay. I believe that when you're raising kids, we have two boys and I have a great wife and she did a really great job with them. I don't know what I did, but I believe there's two things you need to give children. One of those is love and a mother's love can't be beat. Of course, father's love is a different thing. And the other thing is poverty. Poverty is very important to give children. That's a separate subject, but pouring love into children, right? And all children are born beautiful children of God, right? With the ability and capability to love. But when you combine that, and we are programmable, when you combine that with the mother's love and a mom has the ability to pour love into a child, then that increases exponentially their ability to reflect that into others. The challenge here is the family. many areas of the world is hopelessly broken. And we have many fractured family structures for many reasons. Not, you know, not, not anyone's fault. This, this, this life happens, right? I'm not trying to place blame, but we have so many fractured family structures. I was, was standing at a Starbucks one day with a friend of mine and we're having a conversation about something and this person drove up in a vehicle, I'm using very generic language, that suffice to say was very threatening. And they're minding their own business, but they looked like a dangerous person. And my friend says to me, that person's a dangerous person and I'm sanitizing the language to save the audience. And my friend felt very threatened by that person. And I took it upon myself at that moment to remind my friend that we have no idea the life that that person has endured. We have no idea the childhood that that person has endured. We, it is quite, it is, we can very easily assume that they never had a chance. Bernie Youngblood (24:34.446) They're born into a broken family in a broken neighborhood with a broken school system and no one ever gave them a chance and they turned into, forgive the expression, they turned into an a-hole. And a lot of people say I'm an a-hole, but okay, let's say they turned into an a-hole. Well guess what? They never had a chance. And here we are as they say the other expression, the first day you meet someone might be the worst day of their life. Utkarsh Narang (24:54.798) Hmm. Bernie Youngblood (25:03.744) Who are you to judge them? Utkarsh Narang (25:05.794) Let's pause, let's pause. Let's repeat that. Bernie Youngblood (25:07.405) Right? The first day you meet someone might be the worst day of their life. Who are you to judge them? Bernie Youngblood (25:18.84) And this is a very real problem because, as I mentioned, families are fractured. And these kids growing up today, a lot of them never had a chance. In the US, we have this thing called the School to Prison Pipeline. And it's one of the great tragedies of our time. And we suck, and we're not good, and we can't fix it. And I hope and pray that we can, but I feel sorrow. for the kids that are enduring this. A lot of them are lost. Some of them, some of them can endure. Most are lost. And that's gonna have a very real cost. Yeah, a school to prison pipeline. Kids get out high school and they're doing bad things and next thing you know, they're in prison. And they never had, and they, I'm gonna go on the record to say they never had a chance. Utkarsh Narang (26:01.678) Cool to prison you said bunny? Tell me more. Bernie Youngblood (26:20.178) And there's a lot of politicians that they don't mind taking advantage of the situation. So we don't need to get into politics. But it's not great. It's not great. Utkarsh Narang (26:35.264) Mm. I think not. Bernie Youngblood (26:38.818) I'm sorry, I'm casting a shadow on this call. We gotta talk about some good stuff. Utkarsh Narang (26:43.36) No, no, is, I think this is the messiness that we must go through to come out of the other side and see the light. And so let's go back. So you define love as the ability to step into someone else's shoes and feel their pain. My understanding of love is to... Bernie Youngblood (27:02.083) Yes. Utkarsh Narang (27:08.558) to serve the other person unconditionally. Bernie Youngblood (27:13.592) Yes. Utkarsh Narang (27:15.596) And it starts with you. Bernie Youngblood (27:17.624) That's good. Utkarsh Narang (27:18.604) And which is not selfish. It is a very beautiful selfish where I fill my own cup and then I serve others because I want this cup to be flowing infinitely. And I feel like if all of us can. And we're all full of flaws, like we're none of us, neither Bernie nor me, nor the listeners, nor all the guests being here. No, we're not. We're not flawless. We are full of flaws and we we fall and we rise and we fall and we rise again. But love, I think. If I were to choose between love and hate, I would any day or night choose love. It's as simple as that. Bernie Youngblood (27:56.654) You have to, a lot of folks don't understand, but you have to. Hate destroys. As they say, when you plan for revenge, dig two graves, one for them and one for yourself. Hate destroys. The love builds. And as you suggest, and in my experience, the more love you pour into others, you can never have an empty cup. Utkarsh Narang (28:08.556) Oof, club. Bernie Youngblood (28:22.882) The more love you pour into others, the more you will be provided, will be replenished to allow you to repeat that process. It's not possible. When you're pouring love into others, it's not possible to run out. I can tell you that right now. If you have any doubt of that, just look at a single mom raising four kids on her own, right? And somehow indoors. mean, Superman ain't got nothing on her. I can tell you that. That's love. Utkarsh Narang (28:23.566) you Utkarsh Narang (28:49.966) Hmm. Bernie Youngblood (28:50.006) That's an unlimited supply that she has provided as she pours out into her children. Utkarsh Narang (28:56.13) And it all works out. And it all works out. It does. It does. Bernie Youngblood (28:59.416) Yes, inevitably, however it is intended. Utkarsh Narang (29:04.142) Yeah, I love it. And I cannot move to the next thing without asking you. You said two things you can pour into children, love and poverty, love I understand and love you're speaking about. Poverty, mean, I'm intrigued. Tell me more. Bernie Youngblood (29:15.096) Yes. Bernie Youngblood (29:19.722) one of the most beautiful gifts you can give your children is poverty. I know it's, it doesn't, I know it's, it sounds, it sounds strange, but it's true. The, me give you the converse of this. Let me give you the converse of this. I work with a lot of high net worth individuals and consulting and whatnot. And I asked, I asked, I asked them all this, same question. When was the last time, and this is highly controversial, particularly in, in, in these circles. When was the last time you saw someone drop $25 million on a 25 year old kid and it did not destroy their life? And I test people with that question and I challenge you to do the same. generally, generally the answer I get is, never, destroys them every single time. Sometimes they'll say, they come up with one example, one example of a 25 year old who's able to receive $25 million and not resort to the race cars, gambling, cocaine, hookers, take your pick. That's where it's going, right? poverty is a gift. The ability, now I'm not saying make them homeless, but the ability to provide the opportunity for that human being to find their way. If you're a plumber, you're gonna, unfortunately, you know, parents, you know, they live vicariously through their children. You know, if they didn't get the trophy, they want the kid to get the trophy. If they're a plumber, they want the kid to be a plumber. If they're a business, they want the kid to run a business. That's bull crap. What's most important is for that child to become the person that they were intended to be. And providing, as my best friend, the practice he uses, as their parents, it's our obligation. Utkarsh Narang (30:59.982) you Bernie Youngblood (31:18.078) provide for them opportunity and advice and let them make their own decisions once they're adults. Let's get past the adult thing first. Advice and opportunity, that's it. And let them make their mistakes, right? You're not writing them a check. No, that's not the way it works. They have to be able to earn it, particularly with men. You remove a man's opportunity to earn, you destroy him. That's, Utkarsh Narang (31:25.134) you Bernie Youngblood (31:48.692) to any social science textbook, you'll find these you'll you'll find these principles. The so poverty, which and I admit it's a little bit I perhaps I'm exaggerating for effect, but I'm doing that because even in this country, and this is a very challenging subject, we have, last I checked, somewhere in the neighborhood of 70 or 80 trillion trillion dollars, 70 or 80 trillion dollars, trillion with a t, passing from the older generation to their next generation. That's 70 or 80 trillion dollars that are being dumped on adult children, in many cases adult children, like older adult children, but in also many cases children, know, children children. And I promise you that is going to destroy a lot of lives. It's race cars, gambling, hookers and cocaine. I don't mean to beat up on hookers, but the, it's a straw man, if you will. But no, it's not a great idea. Utkarsh Narang (32:52.078) Okay, now I'm clear with that. So now we can move forward. One thing that I was thinking as I was thinking about like our conversation, this idea, human potential, about out of the billion people on LinkedIn, including mine, maybe 200 million are people helping others realize their potential. What does this actually mean? Bernie Youngblood (33:19.15) I'm glad you asked. been given, I've been, I'm a marketing guy, entrepreneur. I use AI every day. So I've been driving myself crazy trying to figure this out, like most people. A good friend of mine put it this way. He believes this next, what is going to be described as the age of AI will be the most human yet. He believes the age of AI will be the most human we've ever experienced. Why? I'll tell you why. Utkarsh Narang (33:37.55) Mm. Bernie Youngblood (33:47.544) Humans are naturally discriminatory. From evolution, depending on thousands of years of evolution, if you will, or tens of thousands, we've come to understand the difference between danger and safety, fight or flight. We are naturally discriminatory. And that's led to a lot of bad things, of course. But that's innate. It's within us. And so here comes AI. And AI is not real. And AI is, go back to we know nothing, AI is based on the sum total of human knowledge. We've already agreed that we know nothing. And so AI, it's impressive, but not that impressive. Not yet. Not yet. But that said, AI is derivative by definition. I believe will not feed the soul. Cannot think of reason. Not yet. And so I'm also going to posit the theory that AI content will not feed the soul. If you're derivative by definition, you cannot reason. I don't think you can feed the soul, right? And so it's incumbent upon us. And so we're to be confronted with AI. We're going to be confronted with AI every day, even more. But we have an innate ability to be able to discern and to be able to discriminate. so we're, even though it's a novelty now, that's going to wear off. And very soon we're going to be turned away, turned off. run away from what is artificial, running towards, of course, what is human. Right? This will be a more human age. I think that's that that is the intent. Accidental intent, or as Elon Musk would say, the most likely outcome is the most ironic. Take us take it one step further. Okay, Bernie, this is going to be a human age. What does that mean? How do we how do we compete? How do we succeed? I'll tell you how. I also believe I will posit the theory. that every human being is born with a gift, some multiple. And it is one of our great challenges in our lives that we should hope to discover what those gifts are. I'm still working on discovering mine, but there are many who discover those gifts. Art, song, engineering, take your pick. Those are gifts granted to every one of us, every one of us, no exceptions. Utkarsh Narang (35:55.177) Mm-hmm. Bernie Youngblood (36:08.498) And if we're so lucky as to discover those gifts while we are still alive, it is then our obligation to share them with the world. That is the key. If we can be allowed within a large organization or in a solo operator, if we can have the ability or be allowed to discover those gifts and share them, that is going to unlock the secrets that we are looking for. I'm talking about technology, medical. all, know, human condition, all the things. Or to put it another way, speaking as a Christian, many religions have these principles. There's man's plan, the way man thinks things are going to be, and there's God's plan, the way, of course, God intended. Man's plan always makes sense. Man makes a good plan and... Utkarsh Narang (36:56.386) Hmm. Hmm. Bernie Youngblood (37:05.035) man's plan has charts and diagrams, right? And it's great. God's plan, right, makes no sense. Very rarely makes any sense at all. Why? Because we're interpreting it with man's mind. And we already talked about, we know nothing, unless every day. Stop it. So this, think, will be revealed to us without our permission. Utkarsh Narang (37:08.11) you Utkarsh Narang (37:21.198) I it. Bernie Youngblood (37:33.646) AI is being thrust upon us. We can't stop it. Horse is out of the barn. This is going to be revealed to us, whether we want it or not. They call it creative destruction. It's going to be horrible. It's going to be horrible, horrible, and beautiful at the same time. That's why they call it creative destruction. And this is AI. Utkarsh Narang (37:51.566) you Utkarsh Narang (37:58.499) I love it, the moment of creative destruction, you said, right? Bernie Youngblood (38:03.79) Horrible, yes. Creative destruction. It's gonna be bad. It's gonna be bad. 10 years of, it's, yeah. Utkarsh Narang (38:05.07) It's to create a discussion. Utkarsh Narang (38:15.214) I always, always wonder, there's this idea that and it's coming from this conversation that you and I are having, there's this idea around our collective consciousness, right, that you and me are streaming the universe together. And some some new ideas are, are intermingling forming and whatever, and you take a group of 10 people in. And if that is moderated in a beautiful way, not controlled moderated, then it'll lead to further enhancement of that collective consciousness. How is this Bernie Youngblood (38:30.84) Yes. Utkarsh Narang (38:44.918) interplay of artificial intelligence with human intelligence, how is that shifting the collective conscience of this planet? Bernie Youngblood (38:56.174) Well, then we have social media, which is becoming part of our consciousness in some respects. I've done a short study of consciousness. have some friends or some books on it. Consciousness is a thing. We know less about consciousness than we do about the oceans. We know less about the oceans than we do about space. Utkarsh Narang (39:00.406) Absolutely. Utkarsh Narang (39:15.97) Mm. Bernie Youngblood (39:16.91) We are spending all the money on all the things that don't really matter. I'm a bald man. They never cured baldness, did they? But they spent a lot of money on it, didn't they? But the consciousness, I'm looking forward to a day, might not be in our lifetime, when we really put a serious investment behind exploring what it is that defines human consciousness, because there's a lot. Utkarsh Narang (39:24.61) I agree. I'm getting there. Yeah. Bernie Youngblood (39:44.398) more there. There. Now to flip the coin, artificial intelligence is going to form a consciousness. Eric Schmidt talks about this at length. At some point the agents, the agents are going to start talking to one another and the agents are going to start talking to one another in a language that we do not understand. And that, you know, as my wife would say, no Hollywood movie of AI ever had a happy ending. So there is a risk here. Utkarsh Narang (39:46.529) Hmm. Utkarsh Narang (40:11.022) Mmm. Bernie Youngblood (40:14.87) But they'll quite likely run out of energy before they could over the world, because they do take quite a lot of energy to run. Maybe the lack of energy will save us. But I don't unfortunately, I don't have the knowledge to be – I don't think to properly address the question. If that makes sense. Am I – I'm dodging the question. Utkarsh Narang (40:21.9) Yeah. Utkarsh Narang (40:31.672) Hmm. It does. It does. It does. No, it's a perfect. Let me let me then throw something else at you and you can choose to hit it or dodge it. Here's here's how I'm thinking and looking at this, right? The collective consciousness will form when we have open conversations, when we have conversations that are not that are not biased by social media, by how our opinions are being formed and reformed because of what we see and what the algorithms want us to see. And so what I'm getting to is that what you were exactly saying a few minutes ago, right? It is the age of us being more human. And if we can learn and excel at that skill, the collective consciousness of this planet will also rise. Bernie Youngblood (41:23.48) I wouldn't, yes, I think that would be awesome. I think that. That would be tremendous. I mean, that's like Star Trek kind of stuff. Peace and harmony. No money. Utkarsh Narang (41:31.776) Yeah, but that's the that's eternal that's the that's the eternal optimist in me saying this, right? Because there's no other lens to life that I have. Bernie Youngblood (41:39.79) . I'm going to compare, I'm going to suggest in my primitive mind that we are living today, it'll be compared, we'll be compared to the 1800s horse and buggying carriages, right? Compared to where we need to get to in order to be able, I believe that day may come. But where we are today, we're still driving horse-drawn carriages. We are so far away from being able to achieve that. I'm heartened, I'm encouraged that social media, which is horrible all by itself, but doing great things, right? We're approaching an age of transparency. You can't get away with your stuff anymore. You do bad things, you are exposed, you are held to account, sometimes you're vindicated. Social media in its teenage years now, it's still very young. We don't even know, no one knows what social, I gotta tell you, no one knows what social media is. This is a technology that's barely 20 years old. We have no idea what social media is. We won't, probably for another 20 years. But I like where it's headed. I like that powerful people are being held to account. I like that transparency, privacy is a thing. That's a whole separate subject. But I like transparency. I like people not getting, not being able get away with their stuff. And I like that people can be vindicated after the fact because the truth, the truth will get out. That's a benefit of social media that folks aren't really paying much attention to because they're all assumed consumed by the sex and the skateboards and the puppy dogs that, that, Bernie Youngblood (43:31.566) score all the points on social media currently. No, think social media is going to be a blessing. I think it's awesome. And 100 years from now, it'll give us the ability to arrive at the destination you described. Utkarsh Narang (43:36.366) Fascinating. Utkarsh Narang (43:47.543) What a crazy world. What a crazy world. Chaos. That's where we started. That's where we started. Bernie Youngblood (43:49.346) Yeah. Chaos. It's a thing. This is awesome. Utkarsh Narang (43:57.345) Yeah, yeah. So where are we? We spoke about love. We spoke about the universe streaming through both of us, about the impermanence of everything, because change is the only constant. And the cliches that we've used so far, Bernie, this will have the highest count. Well done, Bernie and Utkarsh. We're scarring the listeners. Bernie Youngblood (44:18.836) All of them. I got more where that came from. Utkarsh Narang (44:32.012) Here's a thought. And again, this is something that because you and I spoke on that pre-call, it's with me. So I thought I'll not do myself the disservice of not asking this question. Religion, you've spoken a few times about that today. We've not gone into depth and neither will we be able to because we only have 60 minutes. But here's a thought, religion to me, and this is how I see religion, right? It's to me, my anchor. It's to me. Bernie Youngblood (44:45.784) Yes. Utkarsh Narang (45:00.942) that keeps me grounded. And yet there is this other part of me that wants to fly, that wants to, that feels that technology, the next big thing, the next golden shiny object, that's where the growth lies. How do you solve for that paradox? at least enlighten me on Christianity. I was in a Christian school for about 12 years, but I don't understand it fully. I've read the Bible once, but... Bernie Youngblood (45:02.648) Yes. Yes. Utkarsh Narang (45:30.87) not fully, because the Bhagavad Gita says that be non-attached to the outcome, be present in the moment, just do your duty, don't worry about the results and the fruits of whatever is gonna happen. So help me understand, how do we resolve for the paradox that we want to stay grounded and humble while we wanna become the next big skyscraper? Bernie Youngblood (45:32.3) I see it. Bernie Youngblood (45:53.546) Wow, that's a big one. So let me chip away. I'm not going to be able to, I don't think I'd give proper credence to all of that, but let me chip away at it. Utkarsh Narang (45:57.42) It is. Bernie Youngblood (46:08.97) I believe that each one of us were designed to worship something. And I think a lot of people worship the wrong thing, Race cars and gambling, right? But we are designed to worship. It's a natural state. And so the answer is you need to have faith. I do not believe that there is a single religion that is the... correct religion in my interpretation. Religion is made by man for the purpose of control. Faith is made by God. God made the church. God did not make religion, so to speak. Man made religion for control. And it's born out in all these denominations. It's like 40,000 Christian religions just in the United States, not counting all the rest. But something else you have to keep in mind is the word soon. and it's a recurring theme in the Bible. When does the end come? And the answer is always soon. It's not a... it's a date that is actually defined as a date that nobody knows. Not possible to know. Not possible for man to know. What does that mean? Well, in my interpretation, in my journey, my walk, I've come to understand that that date has not yet been set, which means it could be tomorrow. It could be 800,000 years from now. Now in four billion years, our sun is going to explode. So sometime between now and four billion years, we got to figure out how to get off this rock. Otherwise, we reach our end. But when will Armageddon, right, the Christian, call it what you will. and end date come, it's not defined. So in the meantime, I'm also reminded that whatever God we pray to, right, in my case the Christian God, provides, is responsible for everything on the earth, this iPhone included. And from a Christian standpoint, again answering from my perspective, the expression we use is, God can use all things for good. Utkarsh Narang (48:01.295) Hmm. Utkarsh Narang (48:27.982) Hmm. Bernie Youngblood (48:29.208) During a time of, it's ironic as the expression goes, that during times of war, more people find faith than in times of peace. And there's an interesting dichotomy there, right? So that's a whole thing we could talk about. I guess to take it one step further because I'm a big Star Wars, Star Trek geek kind of a person. I've actually had pastors tell me that they look forward to space travel. There's nothing in the Bible that suggests, and this whole argument, don't get me started on flat earthers and the firmament, there's nothing in the Bible that directly contradicts the ability to travel through space. We're doing it right now, some people think. I, for one, do think we went to the moon. But there's nothing precludes us from traveling in space. Utkarsh Narang (49:05.646) Hmm. Bernie Youngblood (49:28.59) So Battlestar, Galactica, Star Wars, The Expanse, all these great programs. There's nothing precludes us from doing that. And since we, since as I suggested, the end date, whatever that is, the rapture, whatever you want to call it, if it does not occur for another 800,000 years, we're gonna colonize Mars. We're gonna colonize Alpha Centauri and... Utkarsh Narang (49:52.174) you Bernie Youngblood (49:55.576) We're going travel faster than the speed of light because guess what? If you can find a scientist that can rationalize quantum theory versus quantum mechanics, I forget what it's quantum theory, quantum mechanics, general relativity and quantum mechanics, which, what I'm told, are not compatible, somewhere in there we're going to find a way to travel faster than the speed of light. And I'm looking forward to that. It probably won't occur in my lifetime. Nothing in the Christian faith precludes these things. So I love the iPhone. And if I had a chance to go to Mars, I might do it. Does that, I don't know if that fully addresses the question. Utkarsh Narang (50:30.19) You Utkarsh Narang (50:36.524) Yeah, yeah. And what you were saying, I think the difference between religion and faith, think that's super important for people to understand. The other idea that he shared, right, that God is responsible for everything in this world that comes out from the Bhagavad Gita as well, which says that the supreme God is like the source and the sustainer. He is responsible for, he's the controller. So everything's happening because of how he is planned for it. But what it also does is Bernie Youngblood (50:57.944) Yes. Bernie Youngblood (51:01.869) Yes. Utkarsh Narang (51:06.39) there's this gap between what he's given us versus the free will that we have. So there's this distinction that there is, there is, there is, there's all of it that he controls, but there is that choice, which we spoke about, and how we're coming full circle, that choice is still ours. And I think that to me is the superpower that we have to unleash the human potential that we're talking about. Bernie Youngblood (51:12.131) yes. no! Not free will! No! Bernie Youngblood (51:32.334) So are you ready to have that conversation? Utkarsh Narang (51:35.404) Which conversation? Bernie Youngblood (51:36.814) Free will. Utkarsh Narang (51:38.337) Should we go there? Bernie Youngblood (51:40.75) So I'll give you the Cliff Notes, because I've given that a lot of thought as well. So if you consider a game of chess, the chess board has a certain number of spaces, each player has a certain number of moves. And you can put the world's greatest chess master up against a supercomputer, and they both win occasionally. One beats the other. You might say, well, to move my pawn or my rook, I have free will. Utkarsh Narang (51:42.604) Mm-hmm. Bernie Youngblood (52:10.744) right? And I can move them however I choose within the confines of the physical reality in which they exist. But at the same time, there are rules. There is a plan, right? A plan. There's only a certain number of moves that can be made. If you were to multiply that chessboard by infinity and then square it, you get an idea for how free will is executed in a divine system. Utkarsh Narang (52:19.438) Correct? Correct? Utkarsh Narang (52:25.07) Hmm. Bernie Youngblood (52:41.736) of intended plan, if you will. In other words, God has a plan, man has free will. Man has the ability to make any choice he chooses within his physical reality. can't go back in time at the present moment. Why we can't fly at the present moment without airplanes. We have the ability to make those moves like rooks and like pawns. But at same time, there are rules governing that. every possible outcome has been pre-det, has been, how do I say, anticipated. Utkarsh Narang (53:18.158) correct. Bernie Youngblood (53:22.082) God does have a plan for our life. And, not or, and he's given us free will to determine that plan. That's the best answer I've come up with. Utkarsh Narang (53:31.128) Absolutely. Absolutely. I love that. I love that. I love that answer. As we now get to the end of a deep conversation that I'll have to listen again with my notes. This is a good one. Let's, let's, we've, we've acknowledged a lot of creators. Bernie Youngblood (53:38.86) Yeah. Bernie Youngblood (53:44.546) This is a good one. Let me tie this one for the books. Wow. Bernie Youngblood (53:50.934) That's you're you're you're tough. Well, you're tough. You ever think about going on a news program and interviewing, interviewing those politicians that weasel out of all those questions? Utkarsh Narang (54:00.013) I would love that. would love that. Maybe the universe listening. The universe is listening. Who knows what the plan is? I'm using my free will, Bernie. I'm using my free will of being on the far past. But let's go, you said somewhere you turned 55, right? So let's go 25 years into the future. To that 80 year old. 80 year old. We've colonized Mars by then Elon Musk has a Tesla running on Mars, whatever that looks like. But at 80 years old. Bernie Youngblood (54:03.628) doesn't Mr. Clark use a hammer? Yes. Bernie Youngblood (54:14.284) Yes. no. I am getting older. Utkarsh Narang (54:28.01) If that Bernie from the future could time travel and come back to you right now and give you one piece of advice on how to live the rest of your years, what would that be? Bernie Youngblood (54:37.866) my goodness. Wait, my 80 year old self comes back to my 55 year old self to give me some advice? Utkarsh Narang (54:44.428) Yes, one piece of advice, not some advice, one. Bernie Youngblood (54:47.246) there's only one thing he's going to say. I tell you what, I know exactly what he's going to say. He's going to say, chill the f*** out. That's what he's going to say. I 100%. Utkarsh Narang (54:52.494) Mm. Utkarsh Narang (54:59.725) Hmm. Bernie Youngblood (55:05.166) Because in full disclosure, I'm a sinner, right? Of course, I'm not perfect in all the things. But God has a plan. It's a good plan. I have it on good authority. It's a good plan. Why should we be anxious? But I'm still anxious. I got anxiety. Utkarsh Narang (55:05.219) Love it. Utkarsh Narang (55:20.226) Yeah. This is Norman. This is Norman. Bernie Youngblood (55:22.114) I got stress. I hate stress. I don't believe in stress. I have stress. I'm human. Utkarsh Narang (55:26.222) So we'll listen to the 80 year old, right? So everyone, to everyone who's one hour into the conversation and still with us, chill the f*** out, chill the f*** out. I'm gonna say the F word. In the spirit of Joe Rogan, I'm gonna say the F word. And remember that we're all in this moment of creative destruction every single day. Change, as Bernie and Utkach have told you, is the only constant. Bernie Youngblood (55:35.214) Yes! Yes! Yes, tell the f*** you do! Utkarsh Narang (55:56.033) and even matter is wanting to get back to a different form. So who are we to say change is not going to happen? We spoke about human potential and the two things that you should give your children, which is infinite love and the experience of poverty. And remember, through all the unresolved issues that you might have from your past self, you have you have free will to choose. So choose wisely. And through all these conversations that we're having, it's the universe that's streaming. streaming through us. And whatever state you're in right now, whether you are pained with what's happening, whether you are full of infinite joy and have just won like a $10 million lottery, remember, this too shall pass. This too shall pass. And wherever you are on this journey, make sure you make it worth it so that if you go back and talk to your eight year self, you can tell that eight year old self, I just love it. I'm not going to change anything. Bernie Youngblood (56:26.755) Yes. Bernie Youngblood (56:40.621) Yes. Utkarsh Narang (56:54.402) that's happened to us in the last forever years. Bernie Youngblood (56:55.81) No. No. Utkarsh Narang (56:59.672) Thank you, Bernie, for this deep space. Bernie Youngblood (57:02.584) Thank you, Utkash. You're awesome. We need to do this again. You should come out to the States, come to Nashville. We'll do a podcast in Nashville. Yes. Utkarsh Narang (57:07.022) Let's do it. Utkarsh Narang (57:10.74) in person. Absolutely love that. Love that. To everyone who's listening on a podcast platform, this is your moment to review us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and share with someone who might love it and want to watch and listen to it again. And if you're on YouTube, put it on the comments. We need to listen to your name to hear you out. Like, what are you enjoying about this? And appease the algorithms because once the algorithm algorithms get appeased and the channel grows and we get bigger and bigger guests. then I can fly to Nashville and meet Bernie. So you've got to make that happen. This is Utkarsh and Bernie signing off. Bernie Youngblood (57:41.102) Yes, yes, make it happen. Bernie Youngblood (57:47.192) Thank you.